rootyrootz
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Post by rootyrootz on Jan 25, 2023 21:48:01 GMT
Does anyone know song name?? EDIT: Is just an improvisation, no? loolAlso that C♯3 section still working? or can we say it goodbye? It's called "On the Street Where You Live" C#3 would look a lot better with a C3 there but if not I'd say it can go. Also, how the fuck does a male singer not have a significant C3!? I buy that you haven't found one but it's just bizarre |
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Post by Homelander on Feb 26, 2023 5:06:31 GMT
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wbradycall
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Post by wbradycall on Nov 3, 2023 0:30:37 GMT
Ivan has recorded quite a bit of classical repertoire and he sounds distinctly baritonal in much of it. If you listen to his unmiked material live (it exists), the way his voice carries in the lower and the middle registers is also indicative of a baritone. Geoff admits he is not a natural bass either. I saw the video where Castellucci talks about that. He mentioned how he loses power below C#2 or D2, meaning that he isn't a natural low bass even though he can easily reach and project A1 or G#1 on any given day. How many singers are natural basses in that sense ? Extremely few. The problem with that is that now "everyone" is a baritone, even though their useful ranges may vary enormously. Bass singers are rare indeed, but I agree with you that it doesn't mean that you have to make up an extremely ridiculous standard like Geoff does for himself lol. It makes no sense to call Geoff a baritone. I've heard many basso cantantes in the world of opera and contemporary music with even less comfortable low notes, such as Cesare Siepi from Italy who was a mostly operatic voice but sometimes sang contemporary on the Ed Sullivan Show. Geoff Castellucci has misidentified himself as a baritone before because he probably doesn't have much experience with the fach system. And to say that someone who both sings and projects a D2 is a baritone does not make any sort of sense for me, personally. Especially if he can both sing and project A1 like you said and can do it with little effort. I've never heard a baritone sing like that consistently in my life (there has been this one instance in which I, as a baritone myself, not only sang an A1 in chest but also projected it as well but it was only once and it never happened again). Ask Peter Barber, a musical genius and opera singer, Geoff is an obvious bass. Opera singers can often be trained to know lots about the fach system. Peter Barber himself has very good explanations for why he has his own opinions in his videos. Watch his reaction videos to show how well he talks about music and how much of a musical genius he is. Related to what Kaji said about basses being rare: And if you were to ask me how rare basses, I'm not sure. I wouldn't say that they're so rare that you would be extremely unlikely to find one in the real world (in contrast to finding one online) if you tried extremely hard. To say that is an exaggeration. But it's probably so rare that most of us would likely only a few of them in our lives coincidentally and some of us may never meet any. And most will probably never coincidentally meet any bassi profondi. |
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Post by CT on Nov 3, 2023 17:04:57 GMT
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kaji
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Post by kaji on Nov 4, 2023 2:47:55 GMT
I saw the video where Castellucci talks about that. He mentioned how he loses power below C#2 or D2, meaning that he isn't a natural low bass even though he can easily reach and project A1 or G#1 on any given day. How many singers are natural basses in that sense ? Extremely few. The problem with that is that now "everyone" is a baritone, even though their useful ranges may vary enormously. Bass singers are rare indeed, but I agree with you that it doesn't mean that you have to make up an extremely ridiculous standard like Geoff does for himself lol. It makes no sense to call Geoff a baritone. I've heard many basso cantantes in the world of opera and contemporary music with even less comfortable low notes, such as Cesare Siepi from Italy who was a mostly operatic voice but sometimes sang contemporary on the Ed Sullivan Show. Geoff Castellucci has misidentified himself as a baritone before because he probably doesn't have much experience with the fach system. And to say that someone who both sings and projects a D2 is a baritone does not make any sort of sense for me, personally. Especially if he can both sing and project A1 like you said and can do it with little effort. I've never heard a baritone sing like that consistently in my life (there has been this one instance in which I, as a baritone myself, not only sang an A1 in chest but also projected it as well but it was only once and it never happened again). Ask Peter Barber, a musical genius and opera singer, Geoff is an obvious bass. Opera singers can often be trained to know lots about the fach system. Peter Barber himself has very good explanations for why he has his own opinions in his videos. Watch his reaction videos to show how well he talks about music and how much of a musical genius he is. Related to what Kaji said about basses being rare: And if you were to ask me how rare basses, I'm not sure. I wouldn't say that they're so rare that you would be extremely unlikely to find one in the real world (in contrast to finding one online) if you tried extremely hard. To say that is an exaggeration. But it's probably so rare that most of us would likely only a few of them in our lives coincidentally and some of us may never meet any. And most will probably never coincidentally meet any bassi profondi. Except that Geoff does not actually project any of that bottom range, and if you listen carefully to his middle range, it is not a bass voice... Do not look at range when you classify voices. It isn't a ridiculous standard. Siepi is a bass. Barber is not a singer who I enjoy in opera. There's many, many, many, many basses out there, both in classical, and contemporary. Neri, Mardones, List, Weber, Siepi, Rossi-Lemeni (who has neither the range nor tone, yet I still consider him a bass), Böhme, Edelmann, Moll, Adam, Tadeo, Hines, Ghiaurov, Ramey, Zaccaria, Talvella, Miller, Zlatopolsky, Giaiotti, Ruffino. Just a few examples. Rossi-Lemeni barely had a good F, yet I still call him a bass. Do not misunderstand why I consider Geoff a baritone. |
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Steingrim
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Post by Steingrim on Nov 4, 2023 10:42:49 GMT
Bass singers are rare indeed, but I agree with you that it doesn't mean that you have to make up an extremely ridiculous standard like Geoff does for himself lol. It makes no sense to call Geoff a baritone. I've heard many basso cantantes in the world of opera and contemporary music with even less comfortable low notes, such as Cesare Siepi from Italy who was a mostly operatic voice but sometimes sang contemporary on the Ed Sullivan Show. Geoff Castellucci has misidentified himself as a baritone before because he probably doesn't have much experience with the fach system. And to say that someone who both sings and projects a D2 is a baritone does not make any sort of sense for me, personally. Especially if he can both sing and project A1 like you said and can do it with little effort. I've never heard a baritone sing like that consistently in my life (there has been this one instance in which I, as a baritone myself, not only sang an A1 in chest but also projected it as well but it was only once and it never happened again). Ask Peter Barber, a musical genius and opera singer, Geoff is an obvious bass. Opera singers can often be trained to know lots about the fach system. Peter Barber himself has very good explanations for why he has his own opinions in his videos. Watch his reaction videos to show how well he talks about music and how much of a musical genius he is. Related to what Kaji said about basses being rare: And if you were to ask me how rare basses, I'm not sure. I wouldn't say that they're so rare that you would be extremely unlikely to find one in the real world (in contrast to finding one online) if you tried extremely hard. To say that is an exaggeration. But it's probably so rare that most of us would likely only a few of them in our lives coincidentally and some of us may never meet any. And most will probably never coincidentally meet any bassi profondi. Except that Geoff does not actually project any of that bottom range, and if you listen carefully to his middle range, it is not a bass voice... Do not look at range when you classify voices. It isn't a ridiculous standard. Siepi is a bass. Barber is not a singer who I enjoy in opera. There's many, many, many, many basses out there, both in classical, and contemporary. Neri, Mardones, List, Weber, Siepi, Rossi-Lemeni (who has neither the range nor tone, yet I still consider him a bass), Böhme, Edelmann, Moll, Adam, Tadeo, Hines, Ghiaurov, Ramey, Zaccaria, Talvella, Miller, Zlatopolsky, Giaiotti, Ruffino. Just a few examples. Rossi-Lemeni barely had a good F, yet I still call him a bass. Do not misunderstand why I consider Geoff a baritone. Castellucci may be one of the most unusual baritones out there. His timbre sounds strange for a baritone, across his range. Maybe he's just an extremely low baritone, without the weight and low note power expected of a bass baritone. |
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kaji
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Post by kaji on Nov 4, 2023 12:45:19 GMT
Except that Geoff does not actually project any of that bottom range, and if you listen carefully to his middle range, it is not a bass voice... Do not look at range when you classify voices. It isn't a ridiculous standard. Siepi is a bass. Barber is not a singer who I enjoy in opera. There's many, many, many, many basses out there, both in classical, and contemporary. Neri, Mardones, List, Weber, Siepi, Rossi-Lemeni (who has neither the range nor tone, yet I still consider him a bass), Böhme, Edelmann, Moll, Adam, Tadeo, Hines, Ghiaurov, Ramey, Zaccaria, Talvella, Miller, Zlatopolsky, Giaiotti, Ruffino. Just a few examples. Rossi-Lemeni barely had a good F, yet I still call him a bass. Do not misunderstand why I consider Geoff a baritone. Castellucci may be one of the most unusual baritones out there. His timbre sounds strange for a baritone, across his range. Maybe he's just an extremely low baritone, without the weight and low note power expected of a bass baritone. To be frank (and I have consulted several scholars on this namely Roger Parker), bass-baritone was always considered to bemore of a fluid term that simply refers to roles that could either be done by a baritone or a bass, and that would also be true for what a 'bass-baritone' is. Take Bertram from Meyerbeer's Robert le diable for example. That is a role that requires high notes up to an F-sharp (note that should be within both a bass' and baritone's range) and also requires a low E-flat (a note that a lot of baritones do have, although not at the level where it would project over orchestration - but would project without heavy orchestration or isolated). That is a perfect example of a core bass-baritone part. Méphistophélès from Gounod's Faust follows a similar rule but takes you from a G to a G. The place where most of the singing happens however is precisely where a lower baritone and higher bass part would sit. Top notes rarely go above an E-flat or an E, and if they do it is usually quick, and low notes just like that do not go often below G or F. Castellucci's voice is not that unusual. The way he uses it is. Had he truly opened it up properly we'd get to hear some wonderful things. Had you heard a dramatic baritone live you'd see just how bassy it can be. Like for example Amartuvshin Enkhbat whom I heard in Rigoletto. It is a voice that covered everyone like a bass would, and had the low notes that you might even expect from a bass, however if one takes a close look at the zona di passaggio it is clearly a baritone. youtu.be/KZC6yw1FC5c?si=fMKXoFbD0VNAlvfa&t=288youtu.be/gwQQWcViJ0I?si=NNHe6aH2gvbce9ta&t=319Anyways this topic is on Cranston. |
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Steingrim
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Post by Steingrim on Nov 4, 2023 13:45:30 GMT
Castellucci may be one of the most unusual baritones out there. His timbre sounds strange for a baritone, across his range. Maybe he's just an extremely low baritone, without the weight and low note power expected of a bass baritone. To be frank (and I have consulted several scholars on this namely Roger Parker), bass-baritone was always considered to bemore of a fluid term that simply refers to roles that could either be done by a baritone or a bass, and that would also be true for what a 'bass-baritone' is. Take Bertram from Meyerbeer's Robert le diable for example. That is a role that requires high notes up to an F-sharp (note that should be within both a bass' and baritone's range) Anyways this topic is on Cranston. I've never heard Castellucci sing well above E4. Reach for notes all the way up to Bb4, he can do that. Bryan Cranston's F4 is probably better. |
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wbradycall
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Post by wbradycall on Nov 4, 2023 15:53:52 GMT
Bass singers are rare indeed, but I agree with you that it doesn't mean that you have to make up an extremely ridiculous standard like Geoff does for himself lol. It makes no sense to call Geoff a baritone. I've heard many basso cantantes in the world of opera and contemporary music with even less comfortable low notes, such as Cesare Siepi from Italy who was a mostly operatic voice but sometimes sang contemporary on the Ed Sullivan Show. Geoff Castellucci has misidentified himself as a baritone before because he probably doesn't have much experience with the fach system. And to say that someone who both sings and projects a D2 is a baritone does not make any sort of sense for me, personally. Especially if he can both sing and project A1 like you said and can do it with little effort. I've never heard a baritone sing like that consistently in my life (there has been this one instance in which I, as a baritone myself, not only sang an A1 in chest but also projected it as well but it was only once and it never happened again). Ask Peter Barber, a musical genius and opera singer, Geoff is an obvious bass. Opera singers can often be trained to know lots about the fach system. Peter Barber himself has very good explanations for why he has his own opinions in his videos. Watch his reaction videos to show how well he talks about music and how much of a musical genius he is. Related to what Kaji said about basses being rare: And if you were to ask me how rare basses, I'm not sure. I wouldn't say that they're so rare that you would be extremely unlikely to find one in the real world (in contrast to finding one online) if you tried extremely hard. To say that is an exaggeration. But it's probably so rare that most of us would likely only a few of them in our lives coincidentally and some of us may never meet any. And most will probably never coincidentally meet any bassi profondi. Except that Geoff does not actually project any of that bottom range, and if you listen carefully to his middle range, it is not a bass voice... Do not look at range when you classify voices. It isn't a ridiculous standard. Siepi is a bass. Barber is not a singer who I enjoy in opera. There's many, many, many, many basses out there, both in classical, and contemporary. Neri, Mardones, List, Weber, Siepi, Rossi-Lemeni (who has neither the range nor tone, yet I still consider him a bass), Böhme, Edelmann, Moll, Adam, Tadeo, Hines, Ghiaurov, Ramey, Zaccaria, Talvella, Miller, Zlatopolsky, Giaiotti, Ruffino. Just a few examples. Rossi-Lemeni barely had a good F, yet I still call him a bass. Do not misunderstand why I consider Geoff a baritone. Just in case if you were offended, I promise that I was not calling you specifically ridiculous. I don't think you're stupid just because I respectfully disagree with you on some things, okay? You probably weren't offended because you seem to act indifferent whenever people get mad at you anyways so you probably don't even care I guess 🤷♂️. |
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kaji
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Post by kaji on Nov 4, 2023 16:11:37 GMT
Except that Geoff does not actually project any of that bottom range, and if you listen carefully to his middle range, it is not a bass voice... Do not look at range when you classify voices. It isn't a ridiculous standard. Siepi is a bass. Barber is not a singer who I enjoy in opera. There's many, many, many, many basses out there, both in classical, and contemporary. Neri, Mardones, List, Weber, Siepi, Rossi-Lemeni (who has neither the range nor tone, yet I still consider him a bass), Böhme, Edelmann, Moll, Adam, Tadeo, Hines, Ghiaurov, Ramey, Zaccaria, Talvella, Miller, Zlatopolsky, Giaiotti, Ruffino. Just a few examples. Rossi-Lemeni barely had a good F, yet I still call him a bass. Do not misunderstand why I consider Geoff a baritone. Just in case if you were offended, I promise that I was not calling you specifically ridiculous. I don't think you're stupid just because I respectfully disagree with you on some things, okay? You probably weren't offended because you seem to act indifferent whenever people get mad at you anyways so you probably don't even care I guess 🤷♂️. Where did you get the impression that I got offended? |
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wbradycall
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Post by wbradycall on Nov 4, 2023 19:01:38 GMT
Just in case if you were offended, I promise that I was not calling you specifically ridiculous. I don't think you're stupid just because I respectfully disagree with you on some things, okay? You probably weren't offended because you seem to act indifferent whenever people get mad at you anyways so you probably don't even care I guess 🤷♂️. Where did you get the impression that I got offended? With all due respect you acted with a mild hint of upsetness. |
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kaji
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Post by kaji on Nov 7, 2023 0:55:56 GMT
To be frank (and I have consulted several scholars on this namely Roger Parker), bass-baritone was always considered to bemore of a fluid term that simply refers to roles that could either be done by a baritone or a bass, and that would also be true for what a 'bass-baritone' is. Take Bertram from Meyerbeer's Robert le diable for example. That is a role that requires high notes up to an F-sharp (note that should be within both a bass' and baritone's range) Anyways this topic is on Cranston. I've never heard Castellucci sing well above E4. Reach for notes all the way up to Bb4, he can do that. Bryan Cranston's F4 is probably better. I disagree. That F has pretty audible closure issues. I would agree on the overall vocal tract shaping being better though but I do not think it's much to do with technique itself as it is noticeable in their speech as well. Where did you get the impression that I got offended? With all due respect you acted with a mild hint of upsetness. Reread it 20 times, I still don't see it. |
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EddieCheivz
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Post by EddieCheivz on Nov 10, 2023 16:20:41 GMT
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Post by CT on Jan 20, 2024 16:32:37 GMT
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Post by Osmosis on Jan 20, 2024 17:35:20 GMT
Already in the thread
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Post by Osmosis on Jan 21, 2024 21:47:39 GMT
Ah I thought you had because he is humming "A Horse With No Name" in this scene as well, and since you have notes labelled from S3E2, which this scene is also from, I thought this was it. My bad.
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